Writing a Book in Public with Jesse J. Anderson

Apr 27, 2022

Jesse J. Anderson's journey to bookdom is unlike any other guest I've had on the show. 

For one, he's not launching a book to help build his business. 

Also, that book—Refocus: A Practical Guide to Adult ADHD—hasn't launched yet. In fact, he hasn't even finished writing it. 

Why, then, you may ask, would I have him on the show? 

Well, part of the reason is entirely selfish: he's writing a book in public and I want to write my next book in public so this is simply a shameless attempt to get some intel. 

If you're wondering what "writing a book in public" even means, you may want to go back to the Rob Fitzpatrick episode, where he breaks down the process he documents in his book, Write Useful Books. If you don't have that kind of time, I'll tell you: it's essentially getting feedback from your readers while you're writing the book. Jesse is in fact doing it using software Rob designed for that very process and, as of this recording, he's about three-quarters of the way done with writing. 

Jesse has also built up an impressive Twitter following by releasing Twitter threads of book chapters—a topic he dove into in detail. 

When he's not writing books in public, Jesse is a designer and developer who has made it his mission to help others better understand what ADHD really is. 


USEFUL LINKS: 

Jesse's site

Jesse on Twitter

Jesse's book-in-progress


TRANSCRIPT:

Anna David:    Thank you, Jesse for being here.

Jesse Anderson:  Absolutely. Thank you for having me. This is great.

Anna David: The reason I reached out to you originally is I am fascinated by this idea of writing a book in public. When I reached out, I didn't know that you were in Rob Fitzpatrick's community. And it happened. So basically, you and I communicated on Twitter, maybe 20 minutes later, I had Rob on my show, just, “Oh, you're in touch with Jesse.” It all happened very fast.

Jesse Anderson:  Yeah. Yeah, I found Rob's book, I guess, almost a year ago, it was in the summer when I actually don't remember when it came out. But this past summer was right around the time I announced that I was writing a book, and I found his book kind of at the same time, and it's been a great guide. Really great book, you got to get it. Write Useful Books is the name of the book. And yeah, I got the book, and I joined his community. And it's been awesome. Yeah, just sort of getting that accountability. And I heard that he was gonna be on your show. And I was, “Hey, I just talked to you. Just talk to her on Twitter.” So yeah, that's funny how that all kind of came together right at that last moment there. 

Anna David:  I know. I was like, Rob, does he think I just literally asked everyone around him anyway, I got it. But you know, you guys have already heard me recommend Rob's book and you've heard that episode. And if you haven't, oh, my God go back. It was like a masterclass in the book. So I am in the process. And I hope my listeners are too, to consider writing a book in public after learning about this process. So walk us through the steps. You read Rob's book, and you go, “Oh, my God, I had no idea. I should be getting a lot of feedback from people.” Is that what happened?

Jesse Anderson:  Kind of, yeah, so I first heard of the idea of writing and public from Arvid Cole, he writes, like technical books. And he had done that writing and public. So I'd heard of it from that. And I kind of thought, well, that really makes sense for what I'm doing. So I'm writing a book on ADHD. I was diagnosed five years ago. And I’m hyper focused on learning all about it. And I kind of acquired all this knowledge. And I didn't really do anything with it, other than learning how to run my own life. But I actually another connection you had Nicolas Cole on here a while ago. 

Anna David:   I know, I saw that you did Ship 30.

Jesse Anderson:   Yeah, so that really kind of sparked all this for me, I don't even remember why. But I joined the Ship 30 for 30 challenge about a year ago. And I didn't know what to write about. I'm a designer. And so I thought maybe I'd write some stuff on design, I didn't end up doing any of that. So the challenge is writing something, an essay every single day for 30 days, which is wild. But I ended up writing several things about ADHD because I had acquired all this knowledge. And it really started to kind of resonate with people. And because I was writing and shipping every day in public, I was getting all these little bits of feedback. And I was hearing from people. And then I was hearing from other stories of people that had ADHD and kind of learning. Oh, you know, when I'm reading, learning about this stuff, I think, oh, everyone that has ADHD is like this. And then I'm learning Oh, no, it's not the same way for everybody. There's kind of all this variability within having ADHD. And so when Arvid Cole, when he was writing in public, I really thought that makes a lot of sense for me, because I know a lot about it, because I've been acquiring this knowledge. But I don't know everybody's situation with living with ADHD. And so by writing in public, it really allows me to get all this feedback, while I'm doing it, just like writing on Twitter and creating threads and getting people replying to that. And then yeah, back to Rob's book. So I read his book, and then that just sort of cemented the idea, Oh, this is perfect. And he has, you know, they have the software to help this book, which makes it really easy to get lots of feedback directly in the book that you're writing. And that's sort of how it's been kind of this wild process over the last year. But yeah, it's been great.

Anna David:    Yeah. And Nicolas or Cole, he's a friend of mine. He's amazing. And he didn't have that program then. I mean, he had his about three businesses ago, that's just sort of how he operates. And we just caught up recently, and he was telling me about Chip 30. I didn't really know but yeah, I mean, what he always talks about is somebody who comes at being a writer cool, you're competing against people like him who put out material every single day. So this idea that alas, we all have, oh, I'm just so like, great and by the way listener, you are great, but like it's probably not just gonna go viral. It's day in day out work which not only gets us better at our craft, but also helps us build an audience. So I'm curious because I was thinking of getting Rob’s software. But for right now it's bundled with the community, right? And I sort of have an ego and I'm like, I'm not going to join a writer, I run a writer's community, are you kidding me? But I really want that software. Because really what he talked about is it encourages people to kind of give you negative feedback, because inevitably, people sort of feel badly and they want to be supportive. And so, I saw you have basically a table of contents out there. Is that all you've gotten feedback on so far? 

Jesse Anderson:    What do you mean all I've gotten feedback?

Anna David:      Well, so when I went to your site, it was like, Okay, so I'm doing this in public. And here's my TOC. And then there was feedback on that, but have you so that's all that I saw, but I would have to join your group in order to see more material? Correct?

Jesse Anderson:    Right. So the way I'm doing it, I'm kind of doing releases, kind of, I will get a draft, you know, because when you're first writing, I've never written a book before. So this is all kind of new to me. And I'm figuring it out. My first draft, I made the promise myself, like, I'm never going to show people this very first, the crappy first draft or whatever you want to call it. I don't want to show that to people, because then it's going to stop me from writing it. So I had to make that promise myself. And then kind of once I got through, I probably was like, 50% of the way through that. And then I really want to show this to people and really start getting this out there because I want this out in public. And that's sort of when basically I spent like a week of like, I'm gonna frantically get it ready this week, to help this book so I can get people to look at it. So separate from that I was doing the thing, you're talking about a table of contents. So at my initial announcement of the book, I said, “Hey, I'm gonna write this book, here's some of the topics I want to cover, please suggest your own.” And that table of contents basically tripled, or maybe even quadrupled, from what I originally listed.

And so at that point, it was yeah, it was just people seeing what I wanted to cover, and then sort of submitting suggestions for additional things. And there's some emails back and forth, like people would say something, and then I would interact through them. And so that part of it wasn't entirely in public. So I was talking with people to understand what they thought was important for the book. And then now that I've done two separate releases on the helpless book. And then the other thing I know, it's kind of chaotic. That's kind of how my whole process is a bit chaotic. So I'm kind of jumping around a little bit. But another thing I'm doing is I'm taking chapters for the book. And I'm like, I'm not really announcing that these are from the book, but I'm just releasing those as a thread. So the chapters of my book are really short. They're kind of like a Derek Severs book where they're probably like two or three pages. So that's kind of a very, very similar model that I'm taking in my book, because my audience has ADHD, and they don't want to read, I know, myself, when, when a chapter is like, 12 pages long. I'm counting the pages I have left to get to the end of that chapter. I need that marker. So for me, like the dark servers, books were really easy to read. Because I was like, “Oh, I can read this chapter. Oh, I can read another chapter.” And so that I have that kind of same focus for my book. But yeah, so I've taken some of those chapters and just released them as a Twitter thread, like, wrote it up, divided it into tweets, and just posted it without saying, Hey, this is from my book, because it's sort of like a rough, early version. And then I get a ton of feedback from that, which has been really great.

Anna David:    So interesting. We should mention, so you went from 1200 followers on Twitter to like over 12,000? How many do you have now?

Jesse Anderson:   Yeah, I'm at like, 37,000 now I think 7000?

Anna David:    And when did the mammoth transformation take place? And how did you do it?

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, so it was kind of a slow, steady growth, being in a Ship 30 for 30 community, I did that for three or four months in a row. And you get sort of each, each month or each session, whatever, when they add new people, a lot of those people follow you through. So through that I probably gained, I don't know, 2000 to 3000 followers over kind of a six month span. And then around December, I was at around 12,000. So it kind of has been the slow steady growth throughout the year. And then this New Year is really when it's just sort of like exploded, and part of that has been this year has been when I've been releasing those kinds of chapters as threads a little bit. And then I've had a few of them that just you know, kind of go viral and have, I don't know, like 50,000 likes and then when that happens, because it's not just like a clip kind of tweet that went viral. It's actually like, Hey, this is good content. I think I get a lot more people that follow when that goes viral because if someone's interested in that, it makes sense for them to follow me. So yeah, it's really sort of exploded in the last like three or four months. Yeah.

Anna David:   When something goes viral do you go well, I should write more about that in my book, then?

Jesse Anderson:  Sort of, I kind of have the tricky balance. LikeI said, I don't want to have a 20 page chapter. The whole goal of the book is to be like, I don't know what it will be. But I want it to be like around 120 pages. Because I know for me, so many nonfiction books are 250-300 pages, and I read 30% of them. And then I hit that wall where I'm like,” woof, I don't know if I can finish this whole book.” So my goal is very much to kind of hit that 120 page range. So when I get feedback from people, like when, yeah, when those tweets go viral, there's lots of comments. I think a lot of the secret to the success of the growth I've had is, it really does feel more like a community than an audience. Like it's not, “Oh, hey, all about Jessie. It's more like, hey, Jesse's sharing this thing about ADHD.” And then a lot of people comment and reply about that thing. So it kind of becomes almost like this. It's like this conversation. It's like a forum within Twitter when these tweet threads go viral. And so because of that, I'm learning through what people are posting on there. And then I try to find the bits, is this conversation really important here? How can I find the small version that's really helpful to get in the book? So I think that a lot of what I tried to do is try to take a complex thing and shrink it down to, how can I communicate this? Well, and you know, a couple paragraphs versus a couple of pages or whatever.

Anna David:    Oh, cool. I was just in contact with Derek Sivers, not to brag. I heard him speak at an event. And then he sort of said, anybody from this event can contact me, such an amazing guy.

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, he's replied to a couple of my emails too, very cool guy. 

Anna David:   Yeah, he loves emailing strangers. He said that during it, I was like, fantastic. So the way it works, I think you mentioned two times, you've sort of delivered it as a manuscript to your team. Is that right? 

Jesse Anderson:   Yeah. So it's, I mean, it's not even really a team, I kind of have an email list of just I just sort of asked publicly, “hey, who would want to read my book early?” And so because I have a pretty large audience, like a lot of people responded. And so I've been able to, which is great. And I feel really lucky and privileged that I have that, that I have a bunch of people interested in the book. Because of that, I've kind of segmented it. So I took 50 people and sent them the first draft. And then and then for the second draft, I picked another 50 people. And I told them about it. And I also told that first 50 People like, “Hey, I know you already read it, but if you want to read the newest version, it's available now too. And so some of those people kind of came back to see the changes and add additional feedback. And yeah, so I kind of have a big list of other people. I think what I'm going to do is one problem I had in the past is like people get it and they're really excited. 

And then they don't do anything, which I know you've talked about before, you're like, “oh, they really said they wanted to do something, and then they're not actually taking action.” So I think what I'm going to do is send out sort of email to all the people that have shown interest, and sort of ask for another opt in of, “Hey, I'm gonna release this draft, and I need feedback within a week. So if you're able to do it, like this isn't disqualifying you from future ones. But if you can do it this week, then press this button.” And I use ConvertKit. So I'll add a tag to them or whatever. And then I can send them a specific email. I don't know if that'll work. But that's sort of my plan for the next draft of, maybe I can get people to be more likely to jump in, if I can get them to opt in and then immediately send them that link. Yeah.

Anna David:   Yeah. Because it's human nature. Yeah, I'd love to help. And then right, yeah, we're all busy. 

Jesse Anderson: But I've done the same thing. So I told her that I don't blame them at all. But it is, you just don't know who's going to be able to do it. And you that feedback is so valuable. I want to make sure I get the people that are able to do it within a reasonable timeframe.

Anna David:   What's interesting about it is it almost is, remember Nielsen Families, like they give a box to a family and my mom was picked at one point, which was crazy, because she didn't really watch TV. And I'm just like, that's crazy. Well, it's like any study there, you're using one person to represent, you know, 1000s or hundreds of 1000s. Because the logical brain goes, Okay, so you're gonna ask 50 people, but how many people have ADD and how many people do you want to read your book? Do you know what I'm saying?  You're just sort of hoping for the best feedback from the people who are interested in that topic.

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah. So kind of like you said, the Help Helpless book really does help get good feedback, because it really cues people I found, because right now the software is only on desktop and not on a phone. A lot of people read the book just on the phone. And I said, if they did that, too, like that was great. Just email me the feedback. And the feedback I got via email was much less helpful. Like some of it was great, but it was just very, this is great. I love the book. This is awesome. It's gonna be amazing. That's great. I love the encouragement, but I need to know how to fix things. So the people that were giving the more concrete feedback throughout the chapters, there's almost nothing that someone said, where I was like, “Yeah, I'm going to implement that exactly.” But there were clues. So I would see that multiple people would say this part was confusing. And so it wasn't like they gave me a solution. But if I'm sending it to, you know, only 50 people have read it. And multiple people are saying this part is confusing, there's probably a better way to say that. And that's kind of how I've treated it. It's not like having a development, developmental editor, or someone that I'm sending, please help me fix this book. It's just like, what are the little problems you have with it? So I can, I can try to go in and fix those and be more clear with what I'm communicating.

Anna David:    Right. Right. So does it require the feedback givers to have the software?

Jesse Anderson: |No, so it's just a web app. So, it's very similar to giving someone a Google Docs link, but with a few extra features. 

Anna David:   Right, right. And one thing that I read that you had said, at one point, you know, you have this newsletter, you have a 50% open rate, which is amazing. We have the same size newsletter. So I got committed, I was like, Whoa, so do you attribute that to you having firmly established, this is what I write about, and they are interested in that? What do you attribute that to?

Jesse Anderson:    I mean, part of it is I'm very intentionally short. So my newsletters it's a weekly newsletter, and it's very short. I basically have, I'll include a couple of resource links, and then like, like, 200 words, or something that most people can read in just like a couple minutes. So it's a very quick read, and I think that is a big part of it. And I'm very consistent that way. I don't know my newsletter, open rate definitely didn't start like that. Early on a lot of my newsletter subscribers came from Tik Tok because I had some Tik Toks that did really well. And my open rate was much lower than, but since I've sort of grown a lot more on Twitter, which I kind of treat as my main platform. Even though I'm on Instagram, and I'm on Tik Tok. Twitter's definitely kind of where I mostly do content. And since my growth has happened through there, that's when kind of the open rate Shut up. And I don't totally know, I feel like I've been lucky and have a lot of success. And I don't necessarily know how it is, I don't know, I'm the lucky Twitter Person of the day or whatever. And what's that?

Anna David:   I don't think it's that, because it's piecemeal. You know, you're not just like a guy who got lucky one day and went viral, like you're doing it. And that's what I think is a really interesting message. You're being strategic and you're being intentional, that it may not happen overnight, but it's happening. And it's only going to grow. 

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, and I think a lot of it does have to do with just being really, I try really hard to be really authentic and vulnerable. I talk about stuff that, you know, for most of my life, I was embarrassed of. Different ways that act in the way my brain works and things that other people would see and say like, oh, man, you're kind of a stubborn jerk, or whatever. And then just explaining how my brain, like how it feels, to me, it's like, I don't feel like I'm a summer, stubborn jerk or whatever. But I feel like this is what's happening in my brain. And by talking about that, I think other people that also have been hiding those feelings, or that way that they felt, connect with it. And that's, I don't know, it's kind of weird to talk about a stubborn jerk like that. That just happened. I happen to think of a recent tweet that was about that. But it's, yeah, I think just like exposing the kind of those vulnerabilities that a lot of people also have hidden it really kind of helps people connect when you have ADHD, especially if you're undiagnosed, like you just you just feel so alone for most of your life. Because you're like, I know my brain works differently and I don't know why. And I don't know how to explain it either. And so I think now that more and more people are discovering that they have ADHD, it's like 90% of adults that have ADHD are undiagnosed, so it's pretty rampant. And now that more and more people are discovering that and then hearing somebody, you know, bring words to a way they've always felt they really connect with that. And I feel like that's really what I've been able to do well this last year is just sort of bring words to that feeling that a lot of people have had. 

Anna David:   Well, and on that note, you know, I saw that you did this annual review, and I'm sure I know, this is like something I've heard about people doing, but yours was the first I read. Is that something that you've done for a while? Where'd you get that idea? I mean, you're being really vulnerable and honest in that?

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah. Yeah. So I haven't done one before. Because I mean, basically, it didn't have any audience before. I've had a blog for, you know, years and years. But no one really ever read it, which is I know the thing Cole talks about, you write a blog, and no one ever comes to it, what's the point of humans doing it? Whereas writing in public really, like that's where people start to see it. And so I had seen several people that had done an annual. They're like, annual report or whatever. I'm blanking on his name. Do you edit this?

Anna David:    We love to be real there. I feel like there's someone who's known for that. Who cares? Somebody google it? Not you. You guys can Google, it doesn't matter. We're talking about Jesse's. So you decided...

Jesse Anderson:    Okay, I just looked it up, it’s Nathan Berry. So he does. ConvertKit. Yeah. So he had done an annual report. And I'd seen a few other ones. And that sort of inspired me, I was like, I should do this. This will be fun to sort of recap the year and recap. It's helpful for me to look back on this next year and kind of see what worked last year, what didn't work, what do I want to focus on? And so, yeah.

Anna David:    And so in it, I think it was that's where I read that, you know, you've done a little bit of speaking and you've been going on podcast and sort of emphasizing that is that stuff you want to emphasize once your book is out?

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, so I, I'm, I think so, I've loved being a guest on different podcasts. Like I love being able to just sort of talk about specifically ADHD but also sort of this process of what I've been going through the last year, because I'm not a writer, prior to this year. My career is in design and development. And I've been doing that for, you know, 15 years or something, and not been a writer. And so all of this is kind of new to me. And I'm just sort of figuring it out. And it's a blast, my ADHD brain loves it. It's all this brand new dopamine that I didn't know was available out here yet, and I don't know what it means long term. People have asked me before that, what does this mean going forward? What are you going to do? And I don't know, like, I'm really enjoying this writing process. And like I think a lot of authors, like I'm writing this book, and I'm like, Oh, this is another book idea, I want to do, oh, this would be another one too. So I have all these other ideas that would be really fun to do. And I'm also launching a podcast called ADHD Nerds, which is just going to be like a 30 minute interview show with other people that have ADHD. So I'm gonna be doing that soon.

And I kind of don't know, there's no end game in mind. Other than, I love what I'm doing. And I love being able to teach people about ADHD because it was so impactful for me, finding out at 35, oh, this is why my brain does things this way or this different way. Where I have this unique take on things. And I love being able to help other people like being part of that story for other people of realizing like, Hey, I'm not just broken. I'm not just, you know, selfish, or lazy, or spacey, or whatever it might be like, there's actually something neurological happening. And when you know about it, you can really change things for the better for you. So I'm enjoying being an advocate for that. And I just kind of just sort of follow wherever this goes and enjoy it a long way. Yeah.

Anna David:   Yeah, that's interesting, because most of the people almost always, it's about like that I talked to you here. It’s usually, how is this book going to play into your business? How is it going to help you get clients? How's it going to help you get, you know, and it sounds like you're open to it, you're certainly open to being hired as someone to go speak about ADHD?

Jesse Anderson:   Yeah, I've done. So I did a talk. I've done some tech talks in the past, like I said, as a designer developer, and I did speak at a couple of virtual conferences last year about ADHD, and I love that. So that's definitely something that, like speaking, is something I'm interested in doing. Eventually, like I said, we'll see kind of where all this goes. But that's definitely something I am interested in chasing down and seeing if that may be a future for me.

Anna David:   But you don't want to coach people?

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, I don't think so. I mean, speaking of coaching, I took some training courses for ADHD coaching, it's something that I think I enjoy Speaking more broadly to people in less on a one on one basis. I think there's so much value in that for sure. But I don't know if that's me. And I haven't shut the door on that. But I've sort of paused, I took the coaching courses on that. And then sort of pause, I don't feel like this is necessarily where I'm headed right now. In the same with, I know, there's a lot of people you have on the podcast where they get into consulting. And that's where there can be a lot of money like, “Hey, I wrote this book.” And now you can hire me to consult, and there's a lot of money there. And I don't think that there's anything really there that makes sense for me. Yeah. And that's why I'm just sort of continuing to create content and seeing where it leads for me. 

Anna David:   So what shape is the book in? Do you have a release date? Where's it at? 

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, so the book right now, I would say is roughly 80% done. And the remaining 20%, I know what it's going to be. I just, you know, haven't sat down and forced myself to write it out. But I would say it's 80% done to get to the point of like, okay, now I need a real editor to come in here and fix them, like copy editing and all that sort of stuff. I don't have a release date, I would love for it to be in the fall this year, like September, October. But I'm self publishing. So I know, there's a lot of things that I need to figure out to get to that in. So I'm sort of trying to line up now so that I can sort of see the end of the tunnel for writing the book. It's like, I really need to start lining up those things, and probably trying to schedule like future podcasts and stuff. Because I'd love to be able to do kind of the podcast tour and get the word out there around the time the book comes out. But yeah, so that's my goal is kind of fall this year, we'll see what happens.

Anna David:   And then are you going to use the people who have been helping like your advanced reader team to do reviews and that kind of thing? Or have you not even gotten there yet? 

Jesse Anderson:    It's definitely something I've considered and want to do. I don't have any plans for that yet. And my my wife has been on like advanced reader teams for other books, just sort of like, you know, unofficially or anything, but I'm probably going to recruit her to take, take charge of some of that, and do some of that communication of getting people excited, and yet doing the reviews. Because I know how important reviews are. It's funny how you don't even think about it before. And now that I'm writing a book, I'm like, oh, I gotta get everyone I know to try and write a review. So that I can get past that hump where you never want someone to come to your book page, and then be like, ah, 17 reviews, that's not enough or something. 

Anna David:   I know. And you just don't realize until you release a book, how much it means and how quick it is to do one, you don't need to write a big frickin novel, just a couple sentences. So as we wrap up, what advice would you give somebody about, you know, sort of going from, I'm not a writer to, hey, I'm writing a book, and it's, it's evident in your face, how excited you are about it? And so what advice would you give somebody?

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, I think a lot of it is just, you just need to put yourself out there, like the building in public is, don't be like, don't be afraid to just write something and then see what sticks. And I know, Cole talks a lot about that, that's a lot of kind of the ship 30 philosophy is, just write about stuff and then see what people care about. I think it's so easy to think, Well, I'm not an expert in this, I don't, like for me, I'm not a therapist, I'm not a doctor, I don't have some education, background and ADHD. But I know a little bit more than a lot of other people. And so it's a lot easier to teach somebody kind of when you're at that level anyway. So really just, I kind of approach a lot of it from like, teach what I didn't know, six months ago. Trying to just teach just a little bit, you know, in the past of who I was, and that's really kind of been successful for me.

I think you don't have to become this high lofty expert of like, you know, teaching down to the masses, like you are just trying to teach a person who, you know, didn't doesn't know what you didn't know, six months ago, and sort of doing that. And I think another thing is, I've really come to understand that it's more about building a community than building an audience. And early on, when you're kind of like, you know, when you're nobody is building an audience, you're just trying to get somebody to look at your stuff. But it builds because you interact with them. And then it becomes like, Oh, I'm actually like, this isn't just a person that reads my stuff. This is my friend that I see like some of the things I post and like I reply to their things, and I get in the comments and all of that. And I think really kind of just thinking about it as a community really helps you change your perspective in the things that you write.

And so whenever I'm writing stuff, I write a lot of like, kind of quippy tweets. It's about random ADHD things. And I just try to think of how I would feel if I saw someone else tweet this thing, like, and what I want people to feel is like, yes, right on. I feel the same way. Like, I'm like this feels like we're sharing this experience together. And that's sort of like that. I try to keep that perspective in mind when I'm talking like not that I'm just sending down something, again, sending down to the masses, but I'm bringing people along. And a lot of times when I'll tweet about things, and I know, I'm talking about Twitter a lot, because that's basically where a lot of my writing starts.

Anna David: Yeah. I think it's really relevant today.

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, so a lot of the thing I do is, I will tweet a question, but with my own answer, so an open ended question. So like, there's this thing called, like, the ADHD tax, which is like, when you have ADHD, there's a whole lot of things that kind of happened, like you forget to pay bills, or things like that. And then you end up paying a bunch of fees on top of it. So people call it like the ADHD tax, because you didn't, because your ADHD causes you to do these things. And then it becomes more expensive. Yeah. And so I recently tweeted, and said, What are some ways that you pre pay the ADHD tax? And then I kind of made it a little thread and added like two or three ways that I do it. And then that kind of helps, because then if someone doesn't have anything to add, they're still like, “Hey, this is great. I'm learning from this.” Or if they do have something to add, it sort of helps build the community because more people start to add in their ideas. And then you end up like with the conversations that happen in the threads. And I find that a really great way to kind of help that community. Basically, I'm sort of presenting a topic to the group like, “Hey, let's talk about this today.” And it's great. And I learned so much through those as well.

Anna David:    Fabulous, so can people who are listening still join the team, that community and give me feedback on your book, or is it too late? 

Jesse Anderson:    Yeah, so I have a let's see what the website is. I want to make sure I have it right. So you can just go to help. I'm so sorry. There we go. Just helpJessewrite.com gives you a place where you can sign up. So if you just go to helpJessewrite.com. Enter your email there. And probably in the next few weeks, I'll be starting my next draft release and inviting people to do that where I'll do, like I said earlier, sort of like, Hey, if you can do it this week, this is the week I really need people to join in. Yeah, like I said, a lot of the stuff I do is on Twitter, and you can follow me . It's just a first name, middle initial last name. So Jessie J. Anderson, and that's my username everywhere. So Twitter, Instagram, Tik Tok and the website JesseJanderson.com.

Anna David:   I love it. Well, Jesse, thank you so much. This was so informative. And y'all thank you so much for listening.

Jesse Anderson:   Awesome. Thank you.



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